Accidents - Overseas

Azerbaijan E190 crash - Russian SAM strike?? Undecided

Via YouTube: These guys were miles ahead of any MSM coverage... Wink




And from SkyNews today:


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JEJU Air 737-800 Crash Muan, South Korea 29 Dec 2024

For obvious reasons there is lots of SME conjecture on this one??

Via YouTube, starting with blancolirio:


Next, courtesy SkyNews:


And from Max Afterburner:


Quote:"Do not build concrete walls at end of runways..." (09:15 min)

What about concrete walls that are part of a DFO shopping centre?? - Rolleyes

Ref: https://auntypru.com/essendon-dfo-accide...christine/

[Image: Untitled_Clipping_091018_103524_AM.jpg]

Finally for the UP thread on this tragic accident, refer - HERE.

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JEJU Air 737-800 Crash Muan, South Korea - 06/01/25: Update

Courtesy blancoliro, via YouTube:


Courtesy Maximus Aviation:


On the subject of airport safety standards and manmade (wall of death) reinforced concrete structures in and around the vicinity of airports, I note there was a fatal light aircraft crash yesterday, near Fullerton Airport California, that brings back some disturbing visual similarities to the 21 February 2021 Essendon DFO accident:



NTSB Presser:


Here is an overhead picture of the Fullerton municipal airport:

[Image: KFUL%2013FEB24.JPG?itok=fIKbKPqQ]

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Washington DC midair collision - Angel

Courtesy Sky News, via YouTube:


Plus for some good analysis (so far), courtesy blancoliro... Wink


+ an update:


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Lear Jet Med Evac Crash KPNE 31 Jan 2025

Courtesy blancoliro, via YouTube:


Plus within 24 hrs, via NTSB.gov:


+


Finally an update (Media Briefing 3) for the Washington DCA midair:


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PS: Compare the NTSB performance to this from 'Popinjay to the rescue'... Dodgy

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A rare case of 'speculation'- Indeed it is'.

“Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak out and remove all doubt.” –

Lincoln nailed it – and this, in particular, should always refer to making comment about an aircraft accident; actually, especially a fatal event, where the 'in's and out's of an event are not 'Gin clear'..(To quote the prophet). However; just this once, I will 'buy in' to the general discussion. There is little to glean from the news reports; and, even less from the pilot (and etc) body making comment and assumptions. The 'facts' as we know them is the aircraft took off and within a short space of time ; reaffirmed it's relationship with Mother Earth. The big (huge) question is why?

In brevi: (forgive the 'Me' factor in this) I have some small experience in both 25 and 35 Lear; I also have a significant amount of 'night operations'; and a reasonable experience in 'Medi-Vac' operations. I must qualify this by adding I have no idea, non, whatsoever' despite this, of what occurred during what should have been a routine, if tedious flight.

There are, despite written works to the contrary, several factors which can and certainly do affect crew 'performance'. Not in a way that can be qualified, say, the 'call out' means contacting someone to pick up the kids, or feed the dog etc. Even  when a 'call out' impinges on a dinner date; or the Plumber, or, Electrician etc. It may even have been a strenuous night or stressful day. But; the investigation must at least 'acknowledge' the mind-set (attitude) and fatigue level of this crew as part of the report. Why? Well – IMHO – this is quite often 'overlooked'. The timing matters. One day's prior notification is 'adequate' i.e. roster-ed and scheduled; or at worst, 'on-standby' for. This is a question I would like to see answered in the 'report'. Only my PoV, but essential IMO; for it speaks to mindset.

Now the 'Lear' gets going; it actually means it, hand flying is demanding but not outside the competencies of a properly trained pilot, with a co-pilot for backup. Hell, you could pull the gear up and go to sleep with a good FO and an operational Auto pilot. Here, right here, on take off, is where my questions begin.

Q1; OK, tired, hacked off, hate the FO, black night take off into weather and all that involves. V!. VR, positive rate, gear up – AUTO PILOT - ON. No? If not,then why not?

Q2. So, OK, it's as black as the Devil's waistcoat out ahead, so it is a good time to sharpen up the skills of trade. Nailed the speed, climb rate spot on, heading rock solid. Real IFR pilots do this stuff for practice; and safisfaction and reassurance that base skills are 'intact' – despite the AP; much fun and greatly satisfying. Selah..However – (big one) “what – if” there was a liar on the instrument panel? Say the AH was 'off'; or, the T&B was telling fairy stories; or, perhaps the Pitot heat had been neglected? There are at least three reasons for a 'loss' of control. But without data we must at very least determine why this crew 'slid down the wing' and arrived, unannounced and uninvited in the middle of a community.

As stated, not my usual 'wait' for the report injunction; but, (IMVHO) this episode reaches deep into some murky pools, pools which underpin so very many neglected elements of an increased PE (pilot error) accident rate. It takes me all the way back to the King Air collision with a building at Essendon (many Moons ago) – it begs a question; one,  which the dead cannot answer. In short WTD was happening on that flight deck? WE shall (patiently) await the guru's response.

Aye: wish I'd never started this – for the 'real' questions may never be answered. But, between public 'speculation' and 'official' diagnoses there will be a 'gap'. A gap which, if filled, may just prevent this conclusion from recurrence. Then again, maybe not.

Said too much – time to retreat to stove, Ale and the company of my quiet mates.

Selah.-.
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DC midair investigation update.

Via the blancoliro channel:


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DC midair investigation update - 16/02/25

Courtesy the NTSB, via YouTube:


Plus courtesy of 'Taking Off' for a summary of the NTSB CVR, timeline and factual findings:

 

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Delta CRJ-900 Crash Toronto - 17 Feb. 2025

Courtesy of blancolirio, via YouTube:


Plus via TSB Canada: Deployment notice

Quote:TSB is deploying a team of investigators following an aircraft accident at Toronto / Lester B. Pearson International Airport, Ontario

Richmond Hill, Ontario, 17 February 2025 —

The Transportation Safety Board of Canada (TSB) is deploying a team of investigators following an accident involving an aircraft operated by Delta Airlines, that occurred today at the Toronto / Lester B. Pearson International Airport, Ontario. The TSB will gather information and assess the occurrence.

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Juan Browne update with 'the facts and only the facts!!' - Rolleyes

Via YouTube:


Quote:300,169 views Feb 22, 2025
Facts do in fact still matter.
LINKS:
Delta Statement:
https://news.delta.com/notice/endeavo...
TSB:
https://www.tsb.gc.ca/eng
Lawsuit:
https://www.motleyrice.com/news/toron...
FAR 61.169:
https://www.govinfo.gov/content/pkg/C...
Flying Eyes 10% OFF:
https://flyingeyesoptics.com/BLANCOLIRIO
    Code BLANCOLIRIO
MERCH:
https://blancoliriostore.myspreadshop...
PATREON:
https://www.patreon.com/user?u=5295000
GEFA Aviation Scholarship:
https://goldenempireflyingassociation...
GROUND SCHOOL: Learn The Finer Points!
https://www.learnthefinerpoints.com/g...
THEME: "Weightless" Aram Bedrosian -
https://www.arambedrosian.com


(02-21-2025, 08:23 PM)Peetwo Wrote:  Delta CRJ-900 Crash Toronto - 17 Feb. 2025

Courtesy of blancolirio, via YouTube:


Plus via TSB Canada: Deployment notice

Quote:TSB is deploying a team of investigators following an aircraft accident at Toronto / Lester B. Pearson International Airport, Ontario

Richmond Hill, Ontario, 17 February 2025  —

The Transportation Safety Board of Canada (TSB) is deploying a team of investigators following an accident involving an aircraft operated by Delta Airlines, that occurred today at the Toronto / Lester B. Pearson International Airport, Ontario. The TSB will gather information and assess the occurrence.

Finally an update from Juan on the DC midair:


NTSB media brief/prelim report link: https://www.ntsb.gov/investigations/Page...MA108.aspx

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DC midair investigation update - 11/03/25

Courtesy the NTSB, via YouTube:


Plus via the blancolirio channel:


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Air India Boeing 787-8 crash Ahmedabad, India

Lot of keyboard Warriors on social media (including the UP) and MSM online sites, offering up bollocks, opinionated and ill informed hypothesis for this tragic air disaster... Dodgy

However there are some YouTubers that at least provide a balanced, unbiased and non-opinionated (the facts and only the facts) overview of what little we know so far of this first fatal crash of a Boeing Dreamliner 787:

Via blancolirio:


&..


Plus from @PilotBlogDenys:


&..


&..


&..


&..


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I have a (purely speculative) theory (for "brainstorming" purposes only.

The 787 is a totally "electric jet". The APU on the 787 only powers a big generator, no hydraulic pumps and no air. On the 787, Electricity powers everything, including all of the electric motors that drive the hydraulic pumps, and the electric motors that drive the cabin pressurization compressors.

FUELING PROCEDURES.
It is SOP that the wing tanks are always filled first.
The center tank is only filled as much as is necessary to make up the actual fuel load required for the particular flight. Rarely (if ever) is it fully filled.

The big red flag here is that SOP is that each engine should always be fueled from it's own wing tank, until well into the cruise.
Then the cener section tank is cross fed into the wing tanks, down to what is normally about ten percent of full, and the flight continues on wing tanks only.

I am of the opinion, that since the last flight was a short one from Delhi, that it is possible, that for some unknown reason, the center section cross feed pumps were still pumping their fuel into the engine cross feed manifold, instead of into the respective wing tanks, when the aircraft landed.
That crew possibly left the aircraft with the fuel system still in that configuration, instead of resetting it to "normal".

Thus, when the new crew got in the aircraft for London, the wing tanks would have been filled as per normal, and more fuel would have been put in the center tank, as per normal. So far so good.

What I am speculating may have happened, is this.

Just like in the Helios 737 disaster, the new crew did not check "EVERYTHING".

The Helios disaster was caused by the new crew not checking that the pressurization system controller was set to "normal" (because ground engineers had done some work on it overnight and had left the controller in "manual", since they needed it in manual to do their trouble shooting).

The "trap" here, is that when a particular system is "ALWAYS" in normal on the ground, it is at high risk of getting "skipped" during pre-takeoff checks.

I am speculating, that similarly, the fuel system is "ALWAYS" in normal on the ground.
I am speculating that the new crew did not check the fuel system configuration setup of the fuel pumps and the cross-feed valves, because they mentally expected them to be "NORMAL" on the ground.

As for the situation from pushback and engine start.
Startup and taxi out would have been perfectly normal with no alerts.
The takeoff roll commenced with "throttle up", and the fuel in the partially filled center tank sloshes aft under acceleration, but not enough to uncover the fuel pump pickups, but it may have been sloshing enough for the pumps to occasionally suck air, which might explain why the takeoff roll appears to have been longer than expected (unconfirmed at this time).
In any case, when the aircraft rotates and pitches up for lift off, the partial fuel load in the center section tank flows even further aft.
This almost certainly uncovers the fuel pump pickups, so the fuel pumps are now sucking air.
At that point, the fuel in the manifold lines from the center section tank to both pylons, and then to both engines, is only enough for 10 to 12 seconds of powered flight.
During this time the aircraft climbs only about 400 feet above runway ground level.
Then the engines are starved of fuel, they begin to roll back, and subsequently flameout seconds later.

Game over.

Thus, I am speculating, that the crew did not ever realize that the engines were not being fed from their wing tanks as they should be but were in fact being fed from the center tank, and it is the last thing they would have thought of in those final few seconds.

In short, simultaneous double engine failure, due to fuel starvation, due to incorrect fuel system configuration for takeoff.

Proximate cause: Human Error.

Ironically, if the center tank had been full, this would not have happened.

This aircraft (and many others) already has "takeoff configuration warning systems" that account for flap and slat configuration errors.

Draft Recommendation:
"Takeoff configuration warning systems" should be amended to add "checks and warnings for fuel system configuration errors".

Succinct and logical.



The 'post' above by Ventus _ HERE _(above)  is informative and a logical theory, worthy of careful consideration and discussion – stand alone. Like most who have actually operated aircraft there is a natural, healthy need to discuss and theorise about 'WTF' happened. Last BRB for example there were some hypothetical notions and 'robust discussions; much like the MH 370 mystery. (Don't mention the 'war').


In among some of the rubbish and amateur wittering posted and videoed spread about, there is some sane speculation. I can't find it now but one post (somewhere) had me reaching for the manuals, like 'V's' post it was worthy of the research effort. FWIW the post mentioned the ground/air systems switch and the way it operates. As I read the 'books' it seems to be a likely candidate. That is 'unqualified' as there is still a heap of manual to sort through; so opinion reserved until I understand it all. But did anyone notice if 'engineering' had been called during the turn around; and, if so, what needed fixing? Insufficient data, but food for thought.


As always, sane, rational discussion is always welcomed by Aunt Pru; but. The play the ball rule is, as always, strictly enforced. Ventus now a Choc Frog recipient.


Toot – toot.
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Nicely done fellahs, see it can be kept in bounds; just no rubbish – please. Cheers; and Yes, I will have another. Cheers..
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From 12 minutes.
https://youtu.be/EblGO0aWcIc
?si=98sYsJAeseWOrJpf
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Why the RAT Changes Everything??

Thanks V, this bloke IMO isn't too far off the money... Wink


Plus:


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Be careful out there...

Sorry – I have been obliged to delete the last two Ventus posts due to 'malware/ bad links, etc etc' (corrupted data). The video below will be the last permitted on site; there are far too many video postings which can and have caused problems. Should you discover a video worth watching, please don't post the link, please post a quick description - - Google Joe Blogs Air India – Electrical – or similar. That way folks can find it, but (BUT) their software will weed out the malicious or corrupting data. Last thing we want to promote is malware into innocent systems.

AP - My apologies for any inconvenience; but the 'web' can be a dangerous place; so, mind how you go. 


Cheers etc 'K”
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