"Things That Make You Go Hmmm..."

"Things That Make You Go Hmmm..." Huh

The purpose of this thread is kind of self-explanatory; so to kick it off here is my first..."thing(s) that makes you go hmmm...??" -  Shy        

Three days ago there was several iterations in the MSM of this story: AP ref - http://www.auntypru.com/forum/thread-103...ml#pid9675

written by Australianaviation.Com.Au December 18, 2018

[Image: ATR72_VH-VPJ_SYDNEY_14MAY2016_SETH-JAWOR...jpg?w=1170]

File image of a Virgin Australia ATR 72-600. (Seth Jaworski)

The Australian Transport Safety Bureau (ATSB) says it is investigating an incident involving a Virgin Australia ATR 72 where both engines on the regional turboprop airliner flamed out, one after the other, while flying in heavy rain.

The incident near Canberra airport involved ATR 72-600 VH-FVN while on a flight from Sydney, the ATSB said on Monday afternoon.

“While the aircraft was descending through 11,000ft in heavy rain, the right engine’s power rolled back (decreased) and the engine flamed out. The engine automatically re-started within five seconds,” the ATSB said.

“The descent continued and, while passing through 10,000ft, the left engine’s power also rolled back and that engine flamed out before automatically relighting. The crew selected manual engine ignition for the remainder of the flight and the landing.”

The aircraft landed safely without further incident, but the flight tracking website flightaware.com shows VH-FVN remained on the ground in Canberra for the following three days, before returning to service operating a flight to Sydney on Monday morning...

Quote:ATSB investigation page: https://www.atsb.gov.au/publications/inv...-2018-081/


The ATSB is investigating an engine-related occurrence involving ATR 72-600, VH-FVN, near Canberra Airport, Australian Capital Territory, on 13 December 2018.
While the aircraft was descending through 11,000 ft in heavy rain, the right engine’s power rolled back (decreased) and the engine flamed out. The engine automatically re-started within five seconds. The descent continued and, while passing through 10,000 ft, the left engine’s power also rolled back and that engine flamed out before automatically relighting. The crew selected manual engine ignition for the remainder of the flight and the landing.
As part of the investigation, the ATSB has downloaded the flight data recorder and will be gathering additional information.
A final report will be released at the end of the investigation.
Should a critical safety issue be identified during the course of the investigation, the ATSB will immediately notify relevant parties so appropriate action can be taken.

Hmm...that 2nd one I would definitely like to see a weather radar depiction of the storm cell that could create a heavy enough rain shower to flame out both engines? - just saying... [Image: rolleyes.gif]

Then yesterday news.com.au came out with this story...  Rolleyes

Quote:Virgin Australia explains why thunderstorms impact flights so much

Nothing frustrates us more than a delayed flight, and lately we’ve had plenty. Now Virgin Australia explains why they have to happen.

[Image: lauren-mcmah.png]Lauren McMah @lauren_mcmah  news.com.au  

DECEMBER 20, 2018 11:41AM

Australians have been reminded lately how a spot of bad weather can send air travel into total meltdown.

Wild storms in Sydney in late November caused massive delays and cancellations that left thousands of passengers stranded, initially in Sydney and then with a ripple effect across the national network.

It came just a week after wild winds in Sydney made it difficult for planes to take off and land, delaying domestic and international travellers for hours.

And with the arrival of Australia’s summer storm season threatening more chaos, Virgin Australia has explained exactly why, and how, thunderstorms cause flights to be delayed.

The airline has released a video with expert commentary from a pilot, air traffic controller, meteorologist and other experts to explain why the difficult decision to delay flights is made.

“Thunderstorms are a very significant issue for airlines and can be very dangerous weather events,” Virgin Australia meteorologist Manfred Greitschus said.

[Image: 36c531c36c6a25e6520281cc9805ac03?width=650]
Recent wild storms in Sydney delayed thousands of passengers across the country. Picture: Virgin AustraliaSource:Supplied

“Depending on the severity of the storm, it has the potential to influence the way we plan flights to avoid flying through any dangerous storm cells.

“When thunderstorms are producing lightening within eight kilometres of an airport, we need to shut down operations on the ramp and this can cause delayed or cancelled flights.”

The video explains how operations will not only be affected by storms at the airport of departure or arrival, but storms that may be encountered en route.

And as airlines like Virgin Australia maintain complex schedule for planes, a storm disrupting one route can trigger delays across the grid.

“The ripple effect can be significant,” Virgin Australia’s OCC duty manager Damien Vezzoli said.

[Image: bfb2d9d5fd1bf5dbd33a83afe573d27a?width=650]
Airlines work closely with meteorologists. Picture: Virgin AustraliaSource:Supplied

“If we take off out of Melbourne, for example, (the aircraft) may not necessarily be going back to Melbourne. It may go Melbourne to Coolangatta and then on to Sydney and then onto Townsville, so that will obviously have an impact down the line.”

Airservices Australia air traffic controller Stefan Burroughs explained how the decision is made to ground flights in storms.

“During a storm event aircraft will deviate from their normal treks and this has an effect on us where we can only accept so many aircraft to arrive and depart,” he said.

“And it’s better to keep aircraft on the ground and it’s a lot safer for the aircraft and for the passengers.

[Image: dd663b8023b11120008c2f77c9e585ec?width=650]
The safety of passengers is the number one concern. Picture: Virgin AustraliaSource:Supplied

“When there is a storm event we work with the airlines to discuss options and what we have is a ground delay program when we can recalculate time of departures to facilitate better departure rates and arrival rates to try and minimise delays. This is done via our National Co-ordination Centre in Canberra and via all the major city airports.”

Virgin Australia’s customer disruption controller, Cameron Todd, said any planned or foreseeable delays to flights were communicated to passengers via text and email.

“It’s really important to us to be able to get in touch with you as quickly as possible,” he said. “What helps us do that is having your most up-to-date contact information.”

[Image: 6e2bcd9a79a637de87b6a0e844da095c?width=650]
Storms in one part of the country can impact air travel elsewhere. Picture: Virgin AustraliaSource:Supplied

The video on how thunderstorms affect flights is part of a series from Virgin Australia that explain behind-the-scenes decisions that affect passengers’ travel plans.

“We understand that cancellations and delays are very frustrating but we want guests to know that their safety is most important to us,” the airline’s general manager of network operations Andrew Lillyman said.

“We’re hoping these videos will also provide the public with some information about what happens behind the scenes and why we make the decisions we do.”

What’s important for passengers to remember is delays or cancellations caused by weather are considered outside an airline’s control, which means travel insurance may not cover any costs associated with changed travel plans.

Hmmm...see what I mean? -  Dodgy

MTF...P2  Tongue

Well: well, well, well. Text from BRB members not present just pinged on my aging ear. Verbatim I do quote it (orders).

“You forgot the list this years ‘best liked’ music piece”.

So, I check the votes and it’s a close run thing.

Leonard Cohen – “Hallelujah” – Driving home category.

Queen – “We will Rock You” – General protest category.

Meatloaf – “Bat out of Hell”  - Instrument approach to minima category. (Try it - we dare ya).

The WINNER, by BRB popular vote is: –

Hmmmm !

Carmody amends embuggerance manual?  Rolleyes

References: 1) Faery dust sprinkles and Pony-pooh. https://auntypru.com/faery-dust-sprinkle...pony-pooh/


(11-20-2018, 11:44 AM)Peetwo Wrote:  2) Oversight of CASA inquiry - Opportunity knocks?

Reference Senate Estimates thread post: https://auntypru.com/forum/thread-57-pos...ml#pid9547

(11-20-2018, 08:58 AM)Sandy Reith Wrote:  Ben Morgan and the other AGAA representatives have done great service in the Senate Committee. Ben in particular has drawn together the various threads and shown how CASA’s wrong policy, the creation of separate entities to be privately run in competition with each other, is against the national interest and out of step with the most effective and successful General Aviation environment, namely that of the USA.  

But towards the end of the videos attached to this thread, from yesterday’s, hearing a remarkable exchange between Carmody and Senator Sterle. I don’t think we’ve ever seen anything quite like it. In the video Carmody emphatically declaring that AOPA and the other GA organisations “signed up” to CASA’s Part 149.

The signatures that purported to be AOPA’s (and other GA industry’s reps) agreement were on a paper that was a meeting attendance sheet. No wonder that an angry and swearing Senator Sterle was spitting chips. 

If Morrison has any antenae tuned in towards this dismal display of blatant bureaucratic degeneracy he might be calling in McCormack for some serious discussions. 

Wonder if the media picks up on this astounding scene. Let’s hope so.

For the benefit of Sandy and others - in pictures the attempted discrediting/deception of AGAA evidence given by Carmody and the CASA executive vs the RRAT committee discovery of the attempt by Carmody to once again potentially mislead the Senate: 

Quote:Hmm...not trying to mislead the Senate again are we Mr Carmody??

Ref: FRMS & the timeline of regulatory embuggerance https://auntypru.com/forum/thread-57-pos...ml#pid9547


& deception 2:


This disgusting but typical behaviour by our STILL Big R-regulator has much documented evidence going back nearly 3 decades of the little regard the likes of Carmody as a professional bureaucrat and the Iron Ring cohort, have for the Senate oversight of CASA.. Dodgy

However I would argue that this time AGAA, the RRAT committee are developing an appetite to take CASA on and expose them for the bullies that they are. 

Reference from tailend of AGAA session Rolleyes :

Somewhat ironically, the RRAT committee Chair has opened up an opportunity for the many industry victims of CASA embuggerance (past & present) and duplicity in process, to finally have their say. However the clock is ticking 2 weeks and counting before the AGAA get the right of reply in a public hearing and to table the A-Z 'evidence' for the committee scrutiny.... Wink 

Ps A quick check - ref: https://www.casa.gov.au/publications-and...ent-manual - still indicates that the Foreword still contains the former CEO of CASA John McCormick's signature:

[Image: DsaLnfAUwAAKK_z.jpg]

...It beggars belief that the current CASA Iron Ring cohort led by Carmody, want industry to ignore the embuggerances of the past and trust the regulator has their interests at heart when arguably the worst CEO to oversee the worst period of Big R-regulator intimidation and therefore industry distrust still has his moniker attached to their still discriminatory, black letter law enforcement manual... 

Not one for believing in coincidences, however it would seem that in a bit over two weeks (a blink of an eye for Fort Fumble -  Dodgy ) Carmody and his front row of trough feeding parasites, had a spur of mind blurring activity and after nearly 3 years of absolutely zilch acknowledgement of the major aberration in their embuggerance manual (see above post links), finally the former DAS McComic's foreword and moniker was deleted from the manual: https://www.casa.gov.au/sites/default/fi...1544141238 (Note: If you click 'File' on the PDF document and then click on 'Properties' you will see that CASA created the amended document at approx 11 am on Friday the 7th of December)  

Quote:4.5 December 2018 Preface: The preface has been amended for consistency with the rest of the CASA manual suite


As a Commonwealth government authority, CASA must ensure that its decision- making processes are effective, fair, timely, transparent, consistent, properly documented and otherwise in accordance with the requirements of the law. At the same time, we are committed to ensuring that all of our actions are consistent with the principles reflected in our Regulatory Philosophy.

Most of the regulatory decisions CASA makes are such that conformity with authoritative policy and established procedures will be conducive to the achievement of these outcomes. Frequently, however, decision-makers will encounter situations in which the strict application of policy may not be appropriate. In such cases, striking a proper balance between the need for consistency and a corresponding need for flexibility, the responsible exercise of discretion is required.

In conjunction with a clear understanding of the considerations mentioned above, and a thorough knowledge of the relevant provisions of the civil aviation legislation, adherence to the procedures described in this manual will help to guide and inform the decisions you make, with a view to better ensuring the achievement of optimal outcomes in the interest of safety and fairness alike.

Shane Carmody
Chief Executive Officer and
Director of Aviation Safety
Q/ Did you notice that Comardy Capers appears to have forgotten to sign the bloody thing?  Dodgy 

MTF...P2  Cool

TP2 said

Q/ Did you notice that Comardy Capers appears to have forgotten to sign the bloody thing? Dodgy

Well noticed, my astute friend. No signature from Noddy Carmody? And the Embuggerance Manual - still has John Francis Skull’s name on it! Can you imagine if the ‘Big R’ Regulator audited your Flight Ops Manual or your mighty SMS Manual and it was current, in use, yet not signed at all, or not signed by the current Chief Pilot or the current Safety Manager, but it was signed by staff who had resigned 3 or 4 years previously? Heaven and hell, CAsA would be screaming ‘strict liabilty’ into your ear and preparing a ‘Friday fax’. But oh no, not CAsA, with them it is ‘do as I say, not as I do’. Not even the mighty Thor, mythical auditing hero and strong arm of ICAO picked up on this during his audit last year!

Tsk Tsk Fort Fumble, you aren’t leading by example.

Testing few features.

Now then;

I want you to all understand that this WAS NOT our very own, beloved Gobbledock playing the Johana, between darts matches, after a ‘few’. It was not, no way, didn’t happen.

Not this Christmas anyway – however………………………


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